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Riftcore
#11
(08-08-2018, 12:08 AM)Stinger Wrote:  The vendor has agreed to take it back as defective.  They won't simply exchange it, but will give in-store credit for the purchase price.

So I will purchase another and hope this one was a rare defect.

I am a firm believer is the KISS principle and think they should have kept a screw-on top.

These sliding tops (showing up on others brands as well) introduce an unnecessary mechanical complexity that is more prone to failure and misbehaving.

The Riftcore took 3 steps forward with the coil-less system, then 2 steps backward with the sliding top. I suspect we'll see an "improved" version in the not to distant future.

ps. why isn't there a specific "Riftcore" forum yet?  Still too new?
 

That's good. We haven't heard of any similar faults on here anyway so perhaps yours was faulty rather than there being a serious design fault, so the silicon may have been not correctly fitted in the first place, it happens.

The sliding tops are in use on most of the Joyetech tanks now, I have a fair few and have never had a problem, haven't read of any anywhere either. You may be interested to hear that the Notchcore tank ( it's new) has a silicon surround in the filling hole and a metal plate that slides across it ( well that's all I can see anyway!). The flip up tops previously used are more complex mechanically - I would imagine they are more prone to failure and damage.

A thread for Riftcore, yes there is, you started it 8)))

Glad you got a result 8)
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#12
(08-08-2018, 01:04 AM)Ippolit Wrote:  A thread for Riftcore, yes there is, you started it  8)))

I'm referring to a product specific subforum that is usually added whenever a new product is released.

eg. current subforums are: ESPION, CUBOID TAP, ProCore Series, ATOPACK DOLPHIN, EXCEED, etc., etc., etc.

I expected to see one for Riftcore when I came back with the problem.
 
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#13
Here you go!

http://social.joyetech.com/showthread.php?tid=28973
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#14
(08-08-2018, 03:33 AM)Ippolit Wrote:  Here you go!

http://social.joyetech.com/showthread.php?tid=28973

Uhh, that's just another general thread, in same forum as this post.

I'm referring to the specific "sub-forums" (as seen rom the home page):
   

And as seen at the top of the "Specific Products" page:
   

Virtually every other Joyetech product has it's own sub-forum, but no Riftcore.

But it's OK, I've got all the info I need for now.
 
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#15
(08-08-2018, 11:58 PM)Stinger Wrote:  ....


And as seen at the top of the "Specific Products" page:


Virtually every other Joyetech product has it's own sub-forum, but no Riftcore.

But it's OK, I've got all the info I need for now.
 

That's where I tried to put it, but it didn't stick. I'll ask the admin 8)
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#16
Hi, dear everybody =) I wanted to share my opinion with silicone gaskets on refill ports. If you use e-liquids with any citrus (lemon, lime, orange and so on) aromas, as well as different "cola" and "energy drink" aromas, it will damage the silicone gasket almost for sure. It's just a property of those aromas being more or less organic, they form some small concentration of lemon acid which will make gasket damaged. Silicone will enlarge (lol, don't know how to describe) and stuck out of it's place.
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#17
(08-09-2018, 03:30 PM)Crazybasil Wrote:  Hi, dear everybody =) I wanted to share my opinion with silicone gaskets on refill ports. If you use e-liquids with any citrus (lemon, lime, orange and so on) aromas, as well as different "cola" and "energy drink" aromas, it will damage the silicone gasket almost for sure. It's just a property of those aromas being more or less organic, they form some small concentration of lemon acid which will make gasket damaged. Silicone will enlarge (lol, don't know how to describe) and stuck out of it's place.

Thanks for this, I had no idea, very interesting. I'm slowly moving over to organic naturally flavoured liquid so that's a concern for me too.

Likely to be the terpene lemonene that causes the problem, being present in citrus fruits and used in many other flavourings too. I just found several references to silicon being permeable to some terpenes including lemonene, also it can cause material breakdown as you said.

Specifically, seal and pump manufacturers advise against using silicon gaskets etc with most terpenes.
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#18
I am somewhat skeptical about this, particularly lacking links to scientific data regarding incompatibility.

"Citrus" based flavors have been used in vaping for years, but I've never heard anyone complain that their silicone gaskets have failed because of them.

I've used 2 different "Citrus" flavors over the past 3 years in 4 other tanks that have silicone o-rings/gaskets in contact with the juice and none of these seals/gaskets have ever deteriorated - still intact and working fine today.

I'm still using one of those "Citrus" flavors in my Cubis Pro, Ultimo and now Riftcore. Neither the Cubis Pro or Ultimo have suffered silicone deterioration.

So, IF "d-Limonene" (the active terpene) IS problematic then:

a) Joyetech should have been aware of it (given the years they've been in business) and put a warning on their tank advertisements to not use "Citrus" based juices, or ...

b) if NOT aware of it, they are now, and should STOP using silicone seal/gaskets.

Many other flavorings contain d-Limonene:

peach, peppermint, spearmint, rosemary, cloves, mints, coffee, mango, eucalyptus, nutmeg, guava, papaya, and many more, in various concentrations.

All of these have been in vape use for years w/out problems.
 
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#19
(08-12-2018, 02:30 AM)Stinger Wrote:  I am somewhat skeptical about this, particularly lacking links to scientific data regarding incompatibility.

"Citrus" based flavors have been used in vaping for years, but I've never heard anyone complain that their silicone gaskets have failed because of them.

I've used 2 different "Citrus" flavors over the past 3 years in 4 other tanks that have silicone o-rings/gaskets in contact with the juice and none of these seals/gaskets have ever deteriorated - still intact and working fine today.

I'm still using one of those "Citrus" flavors in my Cubis Pro, Ultimo and now Riftcore. Neither the Cubis Pro or Ultimo have suffered silicone deterioration.

So, IF "d-Limonene" (the active terpene) IS problematic then:

a) Joyetech should have been aware of it (given the years they've been in business) and put a warning on their tank advertisements to not use "Citrus" based juices, or ...

b) if NOT aware of it, they are now, and should STOP using silicone seal/gaskets.

Many other flavorings contain d-Limonene:

peach, peppermint, spearmint, rosemary, cloves, mints, coffee, mango, eucalyptus, nutmeg, guava, papaya, and many more, in various concentrations.

All of these have been in vape use for years w/out problems.
 

There are many references on the net regarding terpenes (particularly Limonene) and problems with silicon seals, gaskets, pump components and so on. I have not found any references to that problem specifically for vaping devices, perhaps @crazybasil has some.

Just one reference - https://energiforskmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/22208/terpenes-in-biogas-plants-digesting-food-wastes-energiforskrapport-2017-350.pdf

Look at the english section, page 17 Table 2.

As we are volunteer mods and Joyetech users here we cannot specifically address your point that "Joyetech should have been aware of it.." best address that to Joyetech directly.

I suggest therefore that you contact service@joyetech.com explaining your experience and the possible link to Limonene. Please post back with the results, I am interested to hear.
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#20
The problem lies in the concentration of Limonene (we call it lemon acid here). Some quality e-liquid use only the small amount, so it has no effect. Some (probably cheaper) e-liquid use a lot more, and it damages the silicone. Back at the times it also caused polycarbonate atomizer tubes to degrade. I have no scientific data about that, just notes from our e-liquid facility, own experience and customer data. Huge amount of Lemonene sure does cause the damage.
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Here are two MELO 4 gaskets after the exposure to the liquid with huge amount of citrus aroma. They were cut in half to allow further usage. I had the same problem with MELO RT25 tanks, TFV8 tanks (I loved to vape Lemon+Strawberry e-liquid, the same company Lemon+Cola damaged MELO 4 on photo). So this info is indeed legit.
In fact silicone remover is often a mixture of two common terpenes, turpentine and d-limonene. Some silicone food containers are also labeled incompatible with limonene.
(08-12-2018, 03:32 PM)Ippolit Wrote:  I suggest therefore that you contact service@joyetech.com explaining your experience and the possible link to Limonene. Please post back with the results, I am interested to hear.
It's a simple answer: if you are not so sure, then just don't use such e-liquids. I used quality liquids with citrus aromas and they were completely okay, not damaging anything. It's only cheap and unreliable e-liquids, where no one cares about concentration. So it's not an e-cig manufacturer problem, it's e-liquid manufacturer problem and shop problem to not produce or support bad brands. We stopped working with two e-liquid companies whose citrus flavors did damage to silicone.
If you remove the silicone from the tank, but still leave such concentrations of limonene in the e-liquid, only God will know how much damage your health will receive. But your tank will be perfectly safe indeed.
I can remember the history of coils with silica wire. Manufacturers switched to traditional cotton after it was discovered that silica wire hits your throat with a thousands of little needles. It was not widely announced, but you can find mentions of it.
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